said_scarlett | More Seriousness: On Social Pressure In Fandom

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More Seriousness: On Social Pressure In Fandom

Lost internet last night. O.o It was very bizarre.

Alright, I debated heavily about posting this, but.... I've got some things I've got to get off my chest. Mainly about fandom, our investment in it, how fandom actions have real life consequences, and a variety of other commentary that most of my Flist probably doesn't want to hear.

Yes, this relates in a way back to Boobgate/Boobwank/whatever you want to call it.

The thing that's been bothering recently is the dismissal of peer pressure and social expectations in fannish settings. The idea that 'wanting to fit it' or 'not wanting to be left out' or 'giving in to undercurrents of peer pressure' is a stupid notion, and no one out of high school should ever fall prey to any of that.

Bullshit. Fannish settings are still social settings. And in any social setting, there will be dynamics of power and pressure. And some people are above it and don't care. But plenty of people do care. I've cared. I've been there. And I'm not weak willed or damaged or stupid by any means.

It is a natural human reaction to want to be part of a group, to want group acceptance. And there are plenty of times it comes up in fannish settings. I'll use my own fannish history as examples. For me, it's mostly been in RPG settings. I can't count the number of times I've gone along with things I wasn't comfortable with because I didn't want to be the spoilsport, or I didn't want to cause a fuss, or I didn't want the nice, well-loved BNF (and her fans) to hate me. Everything from just RPing a pairing I wasn't comfortable with to joining a game I didn't particularly like. Why did I go along with things if I didn't want to?

Because I'd learned my lesson already that saying 'no' or expressing my discomfort would earn me nothing but problems, cold shoulders, trolling and wank. So when faced with those choices, yeah, I kept my mouth shut and went along with it. And then I remember I was in a game with people I thought were my friends, and who I thought would understand if I didn't want to be part of a particular plotline or whatever. And a plotline came up that I was seriously, seriously uncomfortable with due to real life triggers. And I said so, mentioning I didn't want to be a part of it, and just asking that they label any threads involving this particular plot so I could avoid. And I was attacked. I was made to feel like my issues and my comfort didn't matter in the face of this group of people wanting to have their fun. And it made me feel like crap, and I gave in, and the entire ordeal left me a mess. I was crying. I was sick. And I tried to express this but again, I was dismissed. I was told it shouldn't matter, and it was stupid that it had such an effect on me because it was 'just a game'.

If it was 'just a game' I wondered, why was it such a big deal for these people to make me feel worthless in order to play out their plot? Couldn't they have done it without me easily enough? And just marked their logs? Since it was 'just a game'.

Needless to say, I'm not 'friends' with any of those people anymore. (And I'll say right now that if you're on my Flist now and reading this, you've most likely never been involved in any of the above.)

And I'll readily admit I have been cracking under this fannish social pressure as recently as just a couple of years ago. With RP, it's only since

damned that I honestly feel comfortable enough to speak up if something bothers me, or if I don't want to RP a particular something. And it's not because I'm a moderator - I've been in the above situations plenty of times as a moderator - it's because for once I really don't feel much pressure. In other fannish situations? Well, it's still kind of there. Sure, in little stupid things - joining a particular comm because other people are, doing certain memes because I don't want to be the odd one out, etc - but it's still just evidence of fannish social pressure. And I know the same things have happened to friends of mine. I've seen it happen and been able to do nothing other than offer them a shoulder to cry on. Because otherwise we'd be causing trouble and stirring up wank.

So to me, the idea that there is no peer pressure or social bullying in fandom is ludicrous. Of course there is. Fannish folks are still people, and those dynamics exist wherever there are people. Fandom isn't some magical happy place where everyone respects and understands everyone else. It'd be wonderful if it were, but it's just a huge group of real people with real people brains and real people instinct and real people hang ups all coming together. Good god, I've seen fannish groups that operate like cults, with a charismatic leader and a bevy of devoted, close-knit fans who will go after anyone who dares say anything against their 'leader'.

And I like to think I've never inadvertently pressured anyone into anything, but I can't say for sure I haven't. Maybe I have. Sometimes we don't realize we're doing it. And for me there is a difference between inadvertent pressure and active pressure. They both suck, but the former is usually much easier to do away with and get straightened out.

But I think sometimes we all need to remember that everyone we interact with in fandom is a real person. They aren't a faceless computer entity, they aren't famous, they aren't more than a regular person. They don't have any particular power over us except for the power we give them. And above all, no one, be they mod or admin or webmaster or archivist or BNF or whatever, has the right to coerce and manipulate us into doing things we don't want to, or make us feel like any less of a person for our own choices within fandom.

But that doesn't change the reality that they'll try. :/

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

Very nicely put.

I also don't understand the "it's just a _____" people who try to shut down criticism. They're often the ones who most viciously or persistently attack those who dare to say anything negative. If it's unimportant enough that we should bother criticizing, why is it so important to them that everyone else enjoy it the same amount and same way?

I'm sorry you've had to deal with so much crap in fandom. It should always be the good fun stuff.

Thank you.

I've never understood it either. And there's nothing wrong, I think, with admitting to having an investment into online or fannish activities. They're still hobbies. They still take our time, effort, creativity and everything else.

I know it looks like a lot all condensed in one post, but since everything's been spread out over...oh man, about thirteen years now, it's really not as much crap as it seems. :D It's just all gathered in one place now!

O NOES META

But in all seriousness, I'm totally there with you. I'm not so much nervous about RP stuff as I am about the OOC stuff--I'm always worried about what people think of me as a mod--if they think I'm a good mod, a bad mod, if they're saying things about me I don't know about... I also was way too nervous about posting comments in

fandomsecrets because I thought any opinions might affect any reputation I had negatively. In fact, like... I probably worry more about my fandom reputation than my normal reputation, just because I feel I actually have a fandom reputation to hold up. (Not that I disregard real life as, you know, not real life or anything, because that's just dumb. XD;) Also, while I sometimes genuinely feel totally justified in rejecting people sometimes, other times, I feel really bad doing it. I wonder if our second opinion giver was really very accurate, if we're not being too hard or even pretentious or something... I worry. ;;

But yeah, basically, I know what you mean. :/ And... in that vein of RPing and wanting to meet the expectations of others, maybe here would be a good place to tell you something I've been meaning to e-mail you about these past few days:

---

I.... really want to drop Scar, and as you know, I've been thinking of doing so for a while. The reason I've held off is because of Tess, Callie, and you, but mainly you and your Lust, since... you know, Lust. ;; I mean, don't feel like you guys pressured me into keeping him or anything, since it was mainly me not wanting to disappoint you guys, since I love RPing with you all so much, but lately, I just haven't been able to get around the fact that it's more stressful than it is fun to play him. It's been like that for several months now--I mean, I'll have my moments with him, like around the time of the riot, but mainly, I run into the following issues:

Basically, the fact that I've had him so long feels like as much of a curse as it is a blessing. I mean, realistically, the setting of Landel's would change his characterization, especially while he's in such an emotionally vulnerable state, and it has. The thing is... I feel like he's changed so much at the Institute that if I change him anymore, he'll be truly OOC, and I also feel like he's kind of made a near-full-circle of character development. He's accepted his feelings for Lust, he's trying to take care of others again and trying to have faith in himself... I mean, whenever I post as him, I feel like I'm just going through the motions and not having any fun behind it because I'm so worried about if he's OOC or IC or not, you know? :/ And I thus put off posting with him and stuff even more than I do normally.

Anyway... I needed to talk to you first about this, since your character is, of course, the one most invested in him. I considered whether this is just me being all "LULZ FMA ISN'T MY MAIN FANDOM ANYMORE," but I'm pretty sure it isn't, considering I'm still very enthusiastic about posting as Cid (who's from ancient FFVII land), and considering the fact that I've been considering dropping Scar for a good, long while now. Additionally, while I'll sometimes get as nervous for Cid's characterization as I do for Scar's, I feel excited at the prospect of re-playing FFVII and taking notes, whereas I just... don't feel the drive to re-watch FMA right now, as much as I still get happy feelings about Hughes and Roy and homunculi and even Scar and stuff when I read FMA personal histories. I dunno. D:

But yeah... I am so, so, so, so sorry, man. ;__; I feel bad for you, for Tess, for Callie, for Lust, River, and Dias... but if I keep on trying to RP Scar for you guys, I'm just going to keep disappointing by being slow and flaky, since my heart just isn't in it like it used to be. I guess it's a testament to how far he's gotten with Lust, even if they never really made it to um damned_bedrooms, but yeah.... kdhjfs I feel so horrible but I gotta be honest with myself and you guys. ;__; I'm pretty much set on dropping him, but... I knew you deserved to know and respond before I made it official.

I've been full of meta recently. Which surprises me, because I'm all '...blargh, only fun fandom stuff here! Wheee!'. But fandom does have a very serious side with real life repercussions, and it needs be addressed.

My biggest thing has always been RP, I think, just because I've been involved in it for so long. And it's the most social aspect of fandom that I participate in, so it's where the most social dynamics come into play.

Fandom reputation is something I've stopped caring about, just because...eh. I know my reputation among my friends is a good one, and that's all that matters to me. I used to be the same way, and I wouldn't say a lot of things publicly, but I've realized now that there are so many people who share those private views that I've stopped that. I'll put anything out there, now, and I'm generally glad when I do. :D

I sort of had a feeling this was coming. If it's not fun, it's not fun. And I'll admit I will miss your Scar like burning and I doubt we'll ever have another one who could match him, but you have to do what you feel is best for you. And if your heart isn't in it, your heart isn't in it, and that's seriously all there is too it.

(I do have just a couple of teeny, tiny requests for the actual dropping, just so the whole IC ordeal isn't as horribly terrible as it could be, if that's okay?)

Yeah, definitely. Fandom interaction can be supportive to the point of getting you through tough RL times and assholish to the point of getting you feeling pretty damn depressed. As much ridicule as there is over it, it really can be srs bizness. :/ It also pisses me off when people dismiss assholish fandom behavior as not worth getting angry over, and if people try to retaliate against it, it's automatically "wanky" from the defender's side. I mean, these are still real people being real assholes, even if it's in a virtual setting.

YEAH, I'm cynical over it to a point now, but... I still worry, mainly in the context of

damned, because, you know... it's pretty much our collective baby. ;;

Thanks a ton for understanding--I really, truly appreciate it. I tried keeping it up and getting back into it, I really did, but... all good things must end, I guess. :/

(Of course! That's part of the reason why I wanted to talk to you first--I wasn't sure if it'd be best if he suddenly disappeared or what.)

I've gotten to the point where most of the online assholish stuff just makes me huff and grump until I have a cigarette and find something else to do. Though recently it's been stuff that's crossing boundaries between real life and online, since you know, I actually have a real life now. And all the drama that comes with it.

A lot of people are quick to label anything wank.

My rule of thumb is if I'm ever presenting myself that can be in any way construed as representing any of my communities, I default to being as polite, neutral and professional as possible. Though I do try and maintain that in all aspects of onlineness outside my own locked LJ posts, simply because that's who I am.

No problem. I do understand things just not being fun any longer, and when it gets to that point, there's nothing else to do.

(Okay, I'll try and grab you to work some stuff out!)

This is really well-written, and I completely agree with you. I've never been in a fandom situation where I felt super uncomfortable or pressured to do something I didn't want to, but I can understand it. I've definitely felt almost like certain players are famous, or that what they say must be good or right because everyone likes them or something. ^^;

It seems silly to me that some people would even think that fandom doesn't have normal social pressures. Like you said, just because you're not face-to-face doesn't change the fact that we're all people.

...Oh, and what's a BNF? ^^;

Thank you. I admit, I haven't been in one for a while, but I think that's just with who I've been hanging out with in fandom lately. :D But yeah, those dynamics exist. And people can say 'ugh, that's so high school' all they want, and I will still call bullshit and say no, it's just human nature.

I think there is this idea that anonymity changes everything.

Big Name Fan. Fandom participants who are very widely well known, usually for a particular fannish contribution. Like when you mention them in a random place, people will pipe up with 'OH I KNOW THAT PERSON!' and stuff like that. Basically, fandom famous people.

Aaaaah, okay. Thank you for edumacatin' me! :B

I'm just glad

damned isn't petty like some places. Or, at least, I haven't been privy to any lameness. ^^

Thank you for writing this. I think it's important to think about all of these things, and get them out in the open.

I really debated about putting it out there, but I felt like it did have to be said and brought out into the open. And I'm glad you agree. *hugs*

I've noticed that sometimes writing it down and putting it out there helps me figure out what I think or feel about something. I'm grateful you did, because yeah.

I just recently came to this realization that I've invested almost ten years and hundreds of dollars of actual real-life money on my journal. I felt pressured by some people that I guess were less invested to pretend like things didn't matter just because they were on the Internet, like I wasn't supposed to have real opinions just the coolly detached kind. But I do care about my journal because it's been part of my life for such a long time, and I care about fandom things and I care about people I've met through them. I think you got it spot-on. We're an intensely social species, and I don't think anyone's really above succumbing to social pressures now and again. But we could do with being able to look at it, and see it for what it is.

"Good god, I've seen fannish groups that operate like cults, with a charismatic leader and a bevy of devoted, close-knit fans who will go after anyone who dares say anything against their 'leader'."

Same here, man, same here. Possibly even the same group, but in any case...

I don't think I've ever been in situations as serious as yours, but I can still see where you're coming from. I'm just glad to hear that

damned has been a more or less friendly environment for you and your RPing. ♥ I haven't had any problems, either, so I guess we've got a good group of people. :3 It might also have to do with the fact that we're big on communication.

I'd wager there's a crossover of at least one cultish group going on. ;)

Communication is a big thing. I also thing it may have something to do with the rather relaxed but still close knit nature of the group. Or hell, maybe people just respect me enough there not to try and bully me. Who knows? All I know is that out of all the games I've been involved in, the stress from

damned is the least personal stress I've ever experienced.

Yeah, I don't have much personal stress, either. There might be player-to-player wank I have to help mediate, but I'm only involved in that as a mod rather than as an involved party... If that makes sense. 8D I mean, there is some stress that comes from wondering if people are happy with the game, etc., but I think we usually do our best to field complaints and change things that aren't working, so... I try to tell myself that I'm just being my usual paranoid self annnnd yeah.

yeah, its a lack of personal stress. I stress over getting things done and making sure I've planned everything the right way and things, and that people will like things, but that's about it. And of course I stress like crazy around app time if I've got an app in. :D But I think we all do that.

Fandom's there for fun and really, there shouldn't be any pressure in trying to fit in or stupid arguments over things that can be very personal. There shouldn't but there always will be and I find that kinda sad. >: When something that's supposed to be for fun and for meeting other awesome people is no longer fun to someone... that's kinda sad >:

So, very nicely put c8 You do have a way with words.

I think the main thing we all need to remember is that fandom is just like any other social setting. There will be good times, and bad times. There will be awesome people and there will be assholes. There will be comfortable situations and uncomfortable ones. There will be social pressure, inadvertent or otherwise. And yes, the focus should be on the fun and sharing and meeting people. But too many people fall back on 'but it's just fandom!' to excuse or dismiss a myriad of occurrences. And I just felt the need to speak out about that.

Thank you. *hugs*

I really hope you do not mind me responding to your post (If you do, I will be more than happy to delete this. Also wanted to ask if you minded me friending you, if not, that is ok and I do understand)

You are completely correct in all of this and have put it into a well thought-out entry that speaks to more than just a few, because we all have honestly been there (more than once for many of us I am sure).

Fandom makes people do and say things they may not mean but they are 'going along with everyone else' to do just as you stated, to 'fit in and feel like they belong'. Even if they do it without even realizing it, it happens none the less because it is human nature to want to belong or even be a part of a group setting (and you are completely correct in calling fandom a 'social setting' because that is exactly what it is, minus the face to face interactions).

And I also do believe that many of us forget from time to time that there is a real person connected to those words/images/what have you that find their way online. It doesn't mean someone is a horrible person because of this, it just means they are human and prone to mistakes. I am not saying that there are not people out there that do not do this simply because they can hide behind a digital shield and not have to deal with real-life repercussions because of their actions, but a vast majority do not do it with the mindset that they wish to cause others harm because of their actions or words.

Hey, don't mind at all! :D On either account.

It always gets me how people can deny fandom is a social setting. What is the point of fandom? To meet, connect with, discuss with, share and everything else with other fans. How in the world is that not social?

I think what really got to me was all these dismissals of social pressure in fannish situations. And the whole OSBP took place at a con. Where it was face to face interaction, and therefor even more prone to social constructs than online fandom. Giving in due to social pressure doesn't make someone weak, or damaged, or immature. And to see that idea repeated constantly, along with just outright ignoring and denying that anyone could have felt social pressure to go along with something they weren't cool with really, really bothers me.

The same mistakes that happen in regular social situations - not taking someone's feelings into account, putting our foots in our mouths, whatever - happen online, and we all do it. I'm generally willing to forgive online social faux pas the same as I am in real life. And it all really does just go back to my original point that other than the means of communication, fandom is no different than real life.

*adds you* ^^

Yeah, I totally agree with that. It's no different than meeting up with people in person, so it does boggle the mind how someone could see it any differently. It also boggles my mind how someone can see online friends as not 'real' friends. You have the same sort of connections you do with people in person, the same sort of demographics that come into play in real life, so to see someone say that online friends are not real friends makes not one damn bit of sense.

And yeah, I have been privy to actual con drama that had nothing to do with me but happened all around to those I was with (some even causing it). And no, giving into social pressures is not something that means you are not a strong person, it just means you are human plain and simple. And sadly you find that peer pressure is something that affects everyone (most people just fall victim to groupists: falling into a group mentality and going with what the majority wants) and never really meaning what they say/do as, and sometimes it makes them cater to other's whims even if they are not comfortable with it in the least (and it really isn't that great of a thing when people do not take into account for others feelings or how they might react to a situation differently).

*nods on the last part* It happens, and this is why people have to take into account that sometimes people's actions are not worth getting frustrated over when things can simply be nothing more than a misunderstanding, or someone just not thinking things through before saying/doing something. Yes, some things can just not be forgiven no matter what someone says or does, but as a whole no one ever really means things 100% and second chances are well worth giving (unless it keeps happening over and over again. It is at that point when second chances do and can run out).

You've put it all in a nutshell for me. It is as you say, and I've had similar experiences.

For me GW fandom was the fandom I payed by dues. I got caught up in the hell of fan politics and cried nights over it. I did things I regret and buckled under a lot of the fan BS that goes with a fandom. I did find a list I was comfortable, made friends I liked but the undercurrent was still there and I can remember being an un offical Moderator of a list with the list owner and another mod and dealing with all the ugly politics. It drove me out of Anime fandom for a while.

Its no longer about one fandom for me now. I like many and I do the RPG thing too. It took three years to find a RPG I liked and was comfortable in. The first, was Landels before the first move. I was literally driven out by one of the Mods and made to feel uncomfortable. I had an anxiety attack while talking to her one night and left the night after. The split happened after.

Desai U I managed to get myself drawn into a plot issue with another player and even though I managed to pull myself out of it, I just didn't feel comfortable with certain people I was playing with. I hate being around people who make me feel like I'm treading on eggshells.

I pulled out after several disasters in my home life occurred. Now I've found a RPG I fit in. I am a moderator, it's small, and basically free form for the most part with plots. I enjoy it. I've been there a year now, which is pretty impressive. But it really worked for me. I do tell lots of folks about it, but it doesn't matter to me if they join of don't join.

It's funny because I know it's just a game, but when you see your pup grow and develop its fun and I get this stupid feeling of satisfaction. And when you feel you belong to the group you feel good. I guess that's what it is about really. When you feel pressured about anything, you no longer feel welcome. I was driven away multiple times over being pressured either too "play my pup to someone else's idea of INC", ship one character to another, to "ship" my character to another character I didn't want to ship him too, be in one fandom, or play only X type of character in a game.... It's all crazy fan shit and I could do without it.

Anyhow, decided to delurk. *HUGS* sorry I've been antisocial of late.

I think most anyone who's spent a long period of time in fandom has.

We all paid our dues, and I just hope that we learned from it and can recognize the signs of when we get into an oogy situation now. And it is hard, because of all the things that have been hashed out here in comments. But I think it's an important thing to get out there and discuss.

I think finding that place where you fit in is the most important thing. *hugs*

Don't worry, I know RLs been busy for you!

I think it is important to get it out and try to remember not to do it to anyone else. We all get really jaded by our experiences. I've been so turned off by certain fans it's hard to see the difference from them and other fans in the fandom. Recently, I caught a post on one of my flists. A fan wrote a crossover, Torchwood and Weiss Kruz. A brilliant cross in my book and she was met with such negativity. It was like poo poo, you wrote a crossover and crossovers are universally bad unless they're the fandoms I think that fit.

It just blew me away. Mind you, I'm anal retentive about crossover stuff myself. It has to be written well, but I honestly don't think you should judge it just because it's a crossover. I've seen some awesome stuff out there. A Gundamwing B-5 crossover, wonderpeice, and they made it fit.

Now I have this horridly sour taste for Torchwood fandom. When mind you, I've felt at home in Who-fandom and FMA fandom, both of which have their quarks and wars, but seem to be willing to welcome multifandom fans.

And well, don't get me going about Gundamwing fans... *twitch*

I guess what I'm saying is, we all have things that make us irritable because of how we've been treated or how we see other folks treated, so we react. I damn well know I will NOT post my Torchwood Crossover on the Torchwood lists because of it and I have this negative impression about it, knowing that they hogpiled someone who didn't fit their idea of creativity. Which is likely why I hated GW fandom....

Anyhow, I'm glad you wrote about it. It puts it all in perspective.

*Hugs* thanks for understanding. Hopefully I'll get more free time once things settle down again. I've been dreadful to my flist of late.

(deleted comment)

Most people (myself included) chalk it up to the separation that you have with internet relationships. You're not there in person. It's sometimes easy to forget these are people you're talking to, with lives and existence outside the computer.

I agree with you that it happens so much more often in smaller groups. In every example in my post, it happened when I was in a small group situation. Maybe me and like five or six other people. And when you're literally the odd one out, it makes things difficult and the pressure is insane.

Stupid wank thing of doom aside, this is a really nice post on the pressures of fandom and such and I love you for it.

Yeah absolutly fandom puts on pressure. :(
Anyone who suggests otherwise is crazy 0.o
Any social group does!

Thank you! I'm really glad I got it out there, and that it's opened up this discussion.

Lots of people are crazy, I've been learning.

there is a difference between inadvertent pressure and active pressure. They both suck, but the former is usually much easier to do away with and get straightened out.

Only if you can recognize subtleties. T_T I usually can't, so while I'm aware something is bothering me, I can't put my finger on what. At least with active pressure, it's easier to point out what's going on.

I've only had a problem with big RPs once, at least, and that because a) the mods did NO fact-checking on characters, so a lot of them were wildly OOC, b) when some drama went down that was supposedly my friend's fault (accused of copying a profile's ideas, which she didn't) one of the mods posted pictures of herself crying over it in her journal... yeah. As offended as I was on my friend's behalf, hearing about that just had me laughing too hard to talk for a few minutes!

Well said, hon. Just because we're communicating online doesn't mean we're doing so in a vacuum.

Thank you for saying this. It's strange, seeing LJ and fandom compared to high school plenty of times because there's a perception of an In Crowd and of course you want to be in with the In Crowd.

And the other perception is that we should all be above such things --- and we should! But people being people, it's incredibly hard to manage. It takes a lot of strength of will to just flat-out say "I'm me and I'm okay with who I am, so I don't give a fig," even if it's just to yourself in the privacy of your own home.

Not being part of the perfect circle can be horribly isolating and depressing, especially since I'd wager that many of us in fandom already had to deal with similar situations in our RL high school lives. Finding out that maybe the internet isn't so different after all is quite a nasty shock, especially since the old joke is that on the internet, no one cares if you're a fill-in-the-blank.

Who knows, perhaps they don't care? But when all you have to go on is your opinions and your own boundaries and you really want them to like you, it can be way too easy to just let whatever happens, happen without kicking up a fuss. After all, fussing might make people not like you anymore. And everyone wants to be liked, it's just human nature.

So this is a lurker with a very long-winded way of saying that I'd like to thank you for saying something that needed to be said.

You're more than welcome. It's been such a long standing joke that fandom = high school, but I think it's less a joke and just the easiest way to sum up the social currents of fandom.

I really wish 'on the internet no one cares ____' was true. And in a lot of places, it is. No one my flist cares that I'm a grumpy, gimpy, lesbian who likes to dress up in Victorian clothes or spend a weekend pretending I'm an anime character. But go outside my Flist, and I find people who consider me to be the very epitome of strange.

It can be too easy to let things happen. And I think so many of us have been there, and have kept out head down and our mouth shut because we just don't want to be That Person.

I'm glad you popped out of lurkerdom! :D

You're right, and I'm glad you said this. The Internet may not be physical, but that doesn't mean we're not exchanging our thoughts and ideas--in some cases, baring our souls. Because you can't see the other person, it's easy to forget that you're talking to real people with real lives. But it's crucial to remember this, otherwise you're not going to treat people like that's what they are. Yeah, it hurts to be shunned from social circles, be they Internet or real life. It's human nature to want to be liked, and it's easy to go along with things you don't want just because everyone else is doing it. This wasn't a the end of the world or anything, but back before I grew a spine, I wrote fic for a lot of yaoi pairings that I really didn't like, just because everyone else did, and I thought I had to. It took me a while to realize that yes, my own preferences were valid, and yes, I COULD write what I wanted to write.

I don't RP much, so I've never had to deal with that kind of online pressure--and I'm sorry that you did. But I was in a LARP once, and I wound up going along with a lot of things I was uncomfortable with, including trespassing in buildings I was not legally allowed to be in; trespassing in air fields where the same applied; staying out until 4 AM when I was to be up at 7:30; going in the woods which is full of poison ivy when I react very severely to poison ivy and do not currently possess the health insurance required to get the needed medication if I did get poison ivy; and many, many other things. Finally, they insisted that I blow off the two papers I had due the next day in order to come to a LARP session--and that made me realize that they do not give a damn about me, just my role in the LARP, and that I no longer cared about pleasing them. I dropped the LARP. It's pretendy-fun-games, but when there's pressure like that it's just not fun anymore.

I like to think of fandom as a shiny happy fun place, but sometimes I forget how dangerous it can be. Like, for me, it has been largely shiny happy fun--I've kept out of wank, stayed on people's good sides, and gathered a large group of LJ-friends whom I love dearly.

However. I've dealt with pressure before, and it is part of a list of things that wrecked what was at that time the longest friendship I'd ever had. And it sucked, and I still cry about it, and I still blame myself. I wouldn't give in to pressure, and that's when things started to break down between that person and me. This post of yours is helping to remind me that I was within my rights to refuse and that it wasn't my fault things fell apart when I did. Fandom-related bullying exists--it wasn't just me--and I have as much right to stand up to it as I do real-life bullying. Thank you.

I think we all want to look at fandom that way. Because mostly it is shiny happy fun. Even for those of us who do get stuck in wank, the shiny happy fun outweighs it, usually.

There is pressure everywhere, and to deny it exists in fandom/fannish situations is bullshit, plain and simple. You do have every right to stand up to it. *hugs*

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

More Seriousness: On Social Pressure In Fandom

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